Re: [trafficsafety] List Purpose and Members

Hey Kat,

I am totally with you. I agree that we need to find an equitable long term
solution to this issue. Which I feel will be comprised of many solutions. I
also think that meeting in physical groups is a way that we can learn how to
communicate better with one another ... then we can communicate with others
as well.

jasun

On Thursday 21 September 2006 11:22, Kat Iverson wrote:
> I, too am becoming disillusioned with this list. The Cycling
> Inferiority Cyclists are dominating it and spreading the propaganda of
> the "us vs. them" mentality. Us being the downtrodden cyclists and them
> being the evil motorists.
>
> Two people wrote to me offlist about my statement to Jasun:
> "If driving a small vehicle makes you feel inferior, that's your fault,
> not society's."
>
> One came from someone I know. One sender was anonymous--a nondescript
> sort of e-mail address and no signature. Both writers said I should
> have replied to Jasun offlist. One said my message wasn't useful and
> was poor etiquette. Ironically, Jasun didn't seem to mind my statement
> at all. By the way, I liked Jasun's response--I thought it was funny.
>
> My statement was not meant to be hateful, spiteful, rude, or snippy, and
> certainly not useless. Anyone who thought so should have given me the
> benefit of the doubt, considered the possibility of misinterpretation,
> and asked for rephrasing or elaboration.
>
> So, here is some elaboration for anyone who misunderstood me. I am
> simply trying to impress on everyone that bicyclists ought not to feel
> inferior. Might does not make right. Our society does not operate that
> way. (Maybe no society can, but I'll leave that to sociologists to
> debate) Bicycles, cars, trucks, horse-drawn carts, farm tractors, etc.
> are all legitimate road vehicles. The vehicle code was developed to
> prevent collisions between any two vehicles and between a vehicle and a
> pedestrian. It works because generally people are law-abiding and
> because people don't like to bump into things, whether it be vehicles,
> pedestrians, or telephone poles. Cyclists who cower at the edges of
> roads don't do themselves or other cyclists any favors. They reinforce
> the views of people who believe in cyclist inferiority.
>
>
> On another note, from Brian Sept. 21:
> "Things such as hazardous cyclists on sidewalks, or improvements to the
> streets themselves, will certainly be up for discussion, but realize
> that the focus is dangerous motorists and what we can do that will
> reduce future fatalities."
>
> From the list purpose:
> "Fatalities of cyclists / pedestrians hit by motorists are increasing,
> much of this due to careless and inattentive driving."
>
> My response:
> Oh! you mean only motor vehicle driving, not all careless and
> inattentive driving. So, cyclists never drive carelessly, and all
> car/bike crashes are the motorists' fault? And all this time, I thought
> the focus was dangerous driving--by anyone, regardless of vehicle. Bike
> crashes are so poorly reported that studies are not entirely reliable,
> but many have concluded that about half of all bike crashes don't
> involve motor vehicles and about half of the car/bike crashes are the
> cyclist's fault.
>
> This morning I heard about a cyclist who almost got hit. He was passing
> a motorist on the right on the approach to a side street. The person
> who told me about it called the motorist a fool. Although the cyclist
> was in a bike lane and had the right of way, I call the cyclist a fool.
> Right turns from left lanes are the worst of many dangerous features of
> bike lanes. The possibility of being right hooked is the primary reason
> I avoided bike laned streets for years when I moved to Portland. It
> wasn't until I felt that I had acquired the extra skills needed to drive
> in bike lanes that I began to use those roads. I still avoid them when
> there is a nearby road with no bike lanes.
>
> Although passing on the right by a cyclist in a bike lane and now
> without a bike lane is legal, the only time it is safe to do it at speed
> is when the cars are moving and there are no right-hand side streets or
> driveways into which the motorist might turn. When the cars are
> stopped, passing on the right must be done cautiously because of the
> possibility of being doored by a passenger. I testified against the
> bill that legalized same-lane passing on the right, but the "cyclists
> deserve special privileges" group was more persuasive, and it passed.
>
> It appears that many of the people on this list are not interested in
> education or in better driving, but only in vengeance against motorists.
>
> Kat Iverson,
> Vehicular Cyclist, which means that I drive my bicycle according to the
> rules of the road.
>
>
>
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